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Post by Tom Westman on Aug 29, 2011 14:25:19 GMT -5
 Hey guys, first off congratz. I was aligned with both of you but I never quite trusted Ashley like I did Parvati. Anyway onto my questions. Ashley: I get that you had pre games which i'm against but whatever you got to the end good job. So i want to know what your single best move was? Parvati: you were the person i was the closest too and I was willing to go far with you but like you said with my vacation i was kinda screwed so my question to you is did you ever try during the double tribal to get misty and adam to flip because you knew they were gonners anyway? Thanks guys and goodluck |
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Post by Ashley Underwood on Aug 29, 2011 15:41:56 GMT -5
The thing with my pregame alliance was that it was just two other girls and myself, so we were only 3/20, and were split up, so the true security and benefit of the pregame wasn't truly there, we had to work to make it back to each other and even then 3/X people on a tribe was never a real majority anywhere.
Anyway, onto your main question.
My single best move in this game without a doubt was turning against you and getting people to target you. At the auction you geared up and won reward after reward and added a lot of firepower to your arsenal. Knowing this series, I knew that with the right rewards and spreading them out, a single person can do a LOT of damage and take out whoever they would want. With your rewards and the knowledge that Parvati, Chad, and possibly Misty were more in line with your plans than me, I turned nearly everyone on you and jumped at an opportune moment to eliminate one of, if not, the hugest threat at the time. |
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Post by Parvati Shallow on Aug 29, 2011 16:00:41 GMT -5
Parvati:
you were the person i was the closest too and I was willing to go far with you but like you said with my vacation i was kinda screwed so my question to you is did you ever try during the double tribal to get misty and adam to flip because you knew they were gonners anyway?Hi Tom! <3 i definitely did! Misty was someone i super wanted to work with and she was super close to me so I had been working with her for a while. At first at the double i tried to get rid of Adam so the girls would be like weaker, because Ash was Immuned (but i told everybody it was because he was a threat so they like wouldn't come after me), and tried to get Chad to give his idol to Misty then when that got flipped around and misty left I talked for a super long time with Adam and Chad, but what i learned was that Adam was still super close to Nat and if I hadnt of voted him off he would probably have helped her to vote me off next, and since he was good in challenges i would of had a super hard time winning them. So i could of gone with adam and gotten Barbie out but i knew he would of probably just come after me afterwards. also i should point out about Ash's answer, the only reason i went with it was to get rid of her double vote, figuring that i could use my nullify to vote her off at final five, and she would have no rewards to stop me. so it wasnt that she like turned people on you, it was that i saw an opportunity to get her out.  plus its like kind of BS to say that three people isnt an advantage, when obviously those three were so tight that they were not going to vote each other even when it was way smarter for them to. just because it wasnt a majority doesnt mean it wasnt an advantage, no matter what. hope that is the answers you were looking for, Tommy! <33
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Post by Ashley Underwood on Aug 29, 2011 16:13:02 GMT -5
You only went with it to get rid of my double vote? That's either BS or not smart on your part. Andrea and Natalie were both self voting, and if you had just disagreed and not help spread the word around that the vote was Tom, then me double voting wouldn't have been enough to eliminate Tom.
It certainly wasn't an advantage when we were split up and placed onto separate tribes. The fact was that other majority alliances were a lot larger than us and if they had just stuck together could have picked us off and removed us. The fact is us three girls worked our butts off to weasel in and to dismantle each and every alliance in our path. If people had just banned together and were able to see through us they could have easily voted out three people. |
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Post by Parvati Shallow on Aug 29, 2011 16:37:01 GMT -5
You only went with it to get rid of my double vote? That's either BS or not smart on your part. Andrea and Natalie were both self voting, and if you had just disagreed and not help spread the word around that the vote was Tom, then me double voting wouldn't have been enough to eliminate Tom. I did disagree and could of changed my vote, but then that would of made me lose Misty next because Tom was triplevoting her, so I would of exposed myself as being against you and Ash, and would of lost my backup, so i would have been in a super bad position. im curious which bigger majority alliances your talking about here that could of removed you. Because with adam being together with you that was four of you with pregames so there would of had to have been a five person alliance to take you out and the only time that could of happened is at like final ten, and Julie knew Nat anyway so i kind of dont think so. Also how I see it Natalie did the most of the worming so im curious which alliances you actually busted up yourself? |
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Post by Ashley Underwood on Aug 29, 2011 17:05:41 GMT -5
I already knew you were against me, I knew it from before merge. So in reality you could have kept Tom and cut Misty loose, but instead you caved and not only did you mistakenly sacrifice your alliance of Tom, but doomed Misty as well.
Early on in Babs I wasn't apart of any majority. There was an initial grouping of Tom-Chad-Amber. The Valley Girls which really started off with You-Natalie-NaOnka and then there was a sub-mixing of those two with You-Natalie-Tom-Chad. I wasn't apart of any of those groups until I was brought into the Valley Girls late, and even then I never officially heard the "Valley Girl Alliance" mentioned to me in a direct conversation. Also, to dually note, Adam was never apart of the pregame. It just so happened that he was here, we knew him, decided if we could meet up with him that we would work with him.
And the alliance I busted up? The endgame of You-Tom-Misty-Chad. Y'all were together and I slowly but surely targeted and arranged the fall of 3/4 of you. |
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Post by Parvati Shallow on Aug 29, 2011 17:46:30 GMT -5
I already knew you were against me, I knew it from before merge. So in reality you could have kept Tom and cut Misty loose, but instead you caved and not only did you mistakenly sacrifice your alliance of Tom, but doomed Misty as well. Keeping tom would of lost me misty and probably Barbie, otherwise he would of probably gone at six no matter what because he was gone and if there was a tiebreaker he would of lost automatically. At that point Barbie was promising me to vote you two off a lot, and we are friends so I didnt think she would abuse my trust so badly, so losing Barbie and Misty would of meant that I had to take a huge gamble that Tom wouldnt go after me, and he had already told Chase and stuff that i was like leader and stuff so I didnt want to make that big of a risk. So I chose to keep two people I had no reason to doubt over someone who had already proven to be untrustworthy so I think thats a pretty reasonable decision. Im pretty sure we made up the Tom Chad Amber group. Tom and chad were with me and Nat, but Nat hated Amber wanted her out so she spread around that Amber was with them but there wasnt really proof of it as far as I knew. But how it looks to me is if youre saying you werent in any groups then you just kind of hung back and Natalie did all the work and protected you. So why should people vote you, because you were good at getting Natalie to tell you stuff? Also she definitely did tell me that you were included in Vally Girls from day one so I dont know where youre getting this idea that you werent ever included, unless she just didnt bother telling it to you. loooooooooool that wasnt my endgame plan at all. Misty wasnt even loyal to Tom or Chad because they tried to lie to her at final ten. Plus Im not sure how you should even get the credit for that, because your alliance was like half the people in the game, so pretty much your trying to take credit for voting off... the people who werent in your alliance. Plus Nat was a swing vote at final five and was the one who convinced me to vote you instead of Chad so she gets the credit for that, Nat also got Adam to do a bunch of stuff, so its not like you singlehandedly made those happen. Im sorry but I dont see how convincing your undyingly loyal friends to do what you want them to do is actually a move since they would of wanted to vote those people out anyway. |
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Post by Ashley Underwood on Aug 29, 2011 18:15:34 GMT -5
Keeping tom would of lost me misty and probably Barbie, otherwise he would of probably gone at six no matter what because he was gone and if there was a tiebreaker he would of lost automatically. At that point Barbie was promising me to vote you two off a lot, and we are friends so I didnt think she would abuse my trust so badly, so losing Barbie and Misty would of meant that I had to take a huge gamble that Tom wouldnt go after me, and he had already told Chase and stuff that i was like leader and stuff so I didnt want to make that big of a risk. So I chose to keep two people I had no reason to doubt over someone who had already proven to be untrustworthy so I think thats a pretty reasonable decision. What was the point of you saying you’d expose yourself as being against me if you planned on using Andrea to vote me out in the following two rounds? By saying you would have probably lost Andrea also shows you didn’t trust her word to you earlier on when she said she was in a good position.
Im pretty sure we made up the Tom Chad Amber group. Tom and chad were with me and Nat, but Nat hated Amber wanted her out so she spread around that Amber was with them but there wasnt really proof of it as far as I knew. But how it looks to me is if youre saying you werent in any groups then you just kind of hung back and Natalie did all the work and protected you. So why should people vote you, because you were good at getting Natalie to tell you stuff? Also she definitely did tell me that you were included in Vally Girls from day one so I dont know where youre getting this idea that you werent ever included, unless she just didnt bother telling it to you. You’re right, I did hang back, because I was getting all the information I needed and then plotted and strategized with Natalie and Andrea on what moves to make and who to take down, but then again how can you also say that I hang back but then I say in your opening I made all these pointless alliances? You’re contradicting yourself.
loooooooooool that wasnt my endgame plan at all. Misty wasnt even loyal to Tom or Chad because they tried to lie to her at final ten. Plus Im not sure how you should even get the credit for that, because your alliance was like half the people in the game, so pretty much your trying to take credit for voting off... the people who werent in your alliance. Plus Nat was a swing vote at final five and was the one who convinced me to vote you instead of Chad so she gets the credit for that, Nat also got Adam to do a bunch of stuff, so its not like you singlehandedly made those happen. Im sorry but I dont see how convincing your undyingly loyal friends to do what you want them to do is actually a move since they would of wanted to vote those people out anyway. Mkay, who was your endgame then? Andrea I’m assuming, but even then it seems like you never fully trusted her. So you call me out for not caring and thinking people and challenges weren’t worth my time, when really you’re guilty of the same if you were just looking to use them to get forward.
Natalie wasn’t a swing vote at Final 5, because there was nothing to swing, the minute Chad lost immunity, he was done, case closed. It’s a move because you folded your hand and bought into what we were selling, your game crumbled around you because we all successfully lied to you. You played your independent game because that’s all you had left, when in my game, I did have an alliance and we functioned as a unit, someone, like me, I took the part in vocalizing what I wanted to see happen, and then watching as each of us had a part in making it happen. |
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Post by Parvati Shallow on Aug 29, 2011 19:40:42 GMT -5
lol, now you are just making random accusations i see. The point was that I did want to make that move but did not say anything because I was waiting until the right time. You have to be stealthy like that when you dont have your best friends playing with you. I dont know what would of happened at that final six because Tom and Chad would of voted Barbie probably, and Tom had a vote changer but Nat might of nullified it, so it could of gone either way. No, that's called talking about two different times. At first you just sat back and did nothing and let Natalie and Andrea do everything, then later on for some reason you started randomly making alliance offers that everybody knew were fake. You did both of those things. My endgame was with Misty and Barbie and Natalie. I would of wanted to work with Tom too, but he had said some stuff to Chase and Amber earlier that made me not sure about whether I could trust him even though i super wanted to. And yes I did trust Barbie, she can tell you herself how hurt I and upset I was about how she treated me in this game. I also wanted to trust Natalie too, and it sucked so much that she was lying to me, because we were super good friends at first. And lol its ridiculous to say that we are the same because of how I played. I was not ever looking to just use people, and there is a huge difference between me and you. You tried to use people like Adam and Andrea, and even Natalie as pawns to just do stuff for you, but it was not like that for me. There is not a single person on that jury who can say I voted them off unless they gave me a good reason to. yep, but she could of, and it would of been a good move for her. Same with Barbie. And, I still do not see why your alliance means you should win. This is the finals. It is not about what your alliance did, it is about YOU, Ashley, did. And you have said that your job was sitting there and saying what you want to see happen and watching? Thats like if a guy tells another guy to build a building and then takes credit for the building even though he never lifted a brick himself. The person who actually does the work deserves the credit, not the watcher. In fact, I honestly would like to know what makes you a better player than Barbie or Natalie, because according to every post that you have made in this thread, they were the ones who actually got out and did the hard part in the alliance. |
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Post by Ashley Underwood on Aug 29, 2011 20:22:25 GMT -5
lol, now you are just making random accusations i see. The point was that I did want to make that move but did not say anything because I was waiting until the right time. You have to be stealthy like that when you dont have your best friends playing with you. I dont know what would of happened at that final six because Tom and Chad would of voted Barbie probably, and Tom had a vote changer but Nat might of nullified it, so it could of gone either way. LOL Stealthy!??! Everyone knew what you were up to, you weren’t stealthy in the slightest. Hell I’m sure you thought you were stealthy when you were so adamant on saving Aaron over Adam and then turned around and told Adam that it was because of you that he was still in the game.
No, that's called talking about two different times. At first you just sat back and did nothing and let Natalie and Andrea do everything, then later on for some reason you started randomly making alliance offers that everybody knew were fake. You did both of those things. How is sitting back and collecting information on people doing nothing? Not everyone on the battlefield has to charge out into fire on the front lines, some people do stay behind the scenes and make the battle plans.I talked, to people felt them out, could easily tell who was where and like I’ve already said, made moves based on that.
If you really want to talk about stealth then you should have looked at my game, someone Tom referred to as a “Super Floater” and didn’t suspect deep into the game. And please, please tell me ALLLLL of these alliance offers I was throwing out? That I agreed to stick to the Original Babs Plan? What am I going to say to that? No? Just reveal myself to all of you? I don’t think so idiot, and if you’re going to call me out on not going with the original Babs, then I can easily do the same since your endgame plan included Andrea and Misty.
My endgame was with Misty and Barbie and Natalie. I would of wanted to work with Tom too, but he had said some stuff to Chase and Amber earlier that made me not sure about whether I could trust him even though i super wanted to. And yes I did trust Barbie, she can tell you herself how hurt I and upset I was about how she treated me in this game. I also wanted to trust Natalie too, and it sucked so much that she was lying to me, because we were super good friends at first. And lol its ridiculous to say that we are the same because of how I played. I was not ever looking to just use people, and there is a huge difference between me and you. You tried to use people like Adam and Andrea, and even Natalie as pawns to just do stuff for you, but it was not like that for me. There is not a single person on that jury who can say I voted them off unless they gave me a good reason to. LMFAO. You can ask Natalie, Andrea, and Adam if they ever felt used by me. I told them time and time again that I wanted us four to be the final 4. And you think I can’t say the same about the jury and why I voted them out, bitch please. yep, but she could of, and it would of been a good move for her. Same with Barbie. And, I still do not see why your alliance means you should win. This is the finals. It is not about what your alliance did, it is about YOU, Ashley, did. And you have said that your job was sitting there and saying what you want to see happen and watching? Thats like if a guy tells another guy to build a building and then takes credit for the building even though he never lifted a brick himself. The person who actually does the work deserves the credit, not the watcher. In fact, I honestly would like to know what makes you a better player than Barbie or Natalie, because according to every post that you have made in this thread, they were the ones who actually got out and did the hard part in the alliance. I MADE the alliance. I created the force that ran the entire game. I got out there and was social, set up the plans, and led the charge. I’m sorry that me working in an alliance doesn’t look good to you since you’re trying to overplay your “independent” game which is really just a front because you were NEVER in control of this game. Like I said, you and everyone else had a chance to be, but the alliance that I created and help lead cut you off at the legs every time you tried to be “stealthy” or make a move.
The fact is, if I wanted someone gone, I said I wanted them gone and they were gone at each tribal, which is more than YOU can say. |
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Post by Tom Westman on Aug 29, 2011 20:34:53 GMT -5
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Post by Amanda Kimmel on Aug 29, 2011 20:48:26 GMT -5
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Post by Parvati Shallow on Aug 29, 2011 21:01:41 GMT -5
lol Ill show you what I mean. ummm, you yourself got my endgame wrong, so I guess no everybody didnt know what i was up to. And I actually did not target Adam the round Aaron left, and I did not claim that he was saved because of me, I told him i would try to make sure it wasnt him and that was the truth. I said we shouldnt vote Aaron to keep our numbers up because I knew Chases alliance were tight, but I did not ever say that Adam should be the target until after Aaron was gone. But you said earlier that you werent part of any majority groups, so how could you be getting info from people, if everybody had alliances you werent in? And again, what moves did you make aside from telling people stuff? Sure its a legit strategy but I dont think it makes you the best. Tom didnt suspect what I was doing at all either. lol and now youre calling me an idiot. Im talking about you randomly offering f4 to chad, then randomly talking like me and you and Barbie need to stick together at the final five, when there was really no reason for you to do that. You also tried promising me that you would take me if you won the final challenge which Im pretty sure was fake as well. Thats three right there, and thats just off the top of my head. I dont care that you didnt stick with original babs, and I dont think anybody ever planned on it. See, thats an example of you accusing me of accusing you of stuff = random accusation. Okay, what did Andrea do that made you vote for her? What did Adam do that made you vote him? Oh its not a front. Its the fact that every post you have made has said that your alliance did this or that, and never once did you say that you yourself actually took any action aside from telling people things, which they listened to on account of being your friends. Im just trying to get the facts right, thats all. As I see it I did the best I could with what cards I got dealt. I didnt have pregame friends to be totally loyal to me, so I had to play a different game. I couldnt play the "unbreakable alliance" game, because my alliances were all breakable. Its not bad gameplay that my allies werent solid, its that I dont own a time machine and couldnt go back and become Natalie and Barbies BFF. You should get a little grey hat because you sound just like Russell Hantz.  |
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Post by Ashley Underwood on Aug 29, 2011 21:27:31 GMT -5
Erin Morricci 6:08 pm
question
Brendan 6:09 pm
yesh
Erin Morricci 6:09 pm
at the first swap
you DID tell me that Parvati tried to take credit and tell you that it was because of her that you were still in over aaron correct
Brendan 6:11 pm
she acted as if she was the main one in my corner, yes
Natalie, Andrea and I already had him covered. You saying that you told him you'd try and make sure it was him meant nothing.
It wasn't always about information pertaining to alliances and who's with who. I would always be careful with my words, pay attention to what people would say and ask me directly. Being social doesn't just have the sole purpose of building alliances and bonds, it's easy to tell a lot about a person and how they play just from how they talk with and to you.
Well shame on him then. Can you not read, the Final 4 Chad wanted at that point was the original Babs Chu card that I mentioned being pulled above. A card which you pulled at the time as well. I wasn't about to go "No thanks, I don't need you, so go ahead and vote me" right to his face.
That wasn't a lie. You, Andrea, and I did need to stick together at the Final 5 to vote out Chad, and Andrea and I honored that, but YOU were the one to go around on that and vote for me, and not Chad.
Bitch when did I EVER promise to take you. I simply played along with your "Most Deserving" Final 2 BS in case you won. I never promised you shit. You even said yourself that you had heard Natalie and I were really good friends, so why the hell would I suddenly turn on her? You'd be an idiot to believe I'd vote her out over you, fake promise or not.
NOT a random accusation considering that's what my whole "lie" to Chad was about. Chad even came back to me asking me if he was going and did I "Lie" then and tell him he was safe, nope, I told him he was going out. Andrea:
Andrea knows I love her, and she even talks to me how she isn't the best at challenges. I wanted Natalie with me because I thought the two of us had a better combined shot at beating you.
Adam:
I loved Adam too, but I was going to be loyal to my original alliance and carry the Mean Girls onwards, which left Adam as my only available option to vote.
I guess you have selective vision and pretty much omitted the fact that I said I FORMED the alliance. I formed it, helped keep it intact and LEAD it. It seems all you have is to try and downplay my game because in reality you know your game pales in comparison. The game of Survivor is hardly ever about being as independent as you can be, it's a social game, I was social enough up to the point where I was only ever targeted ONCE in this game and was social enough to articulate what I wanted to happen with each vote which, 9 times out of 9, happened. |
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Post by Ashley Underwood on Aug 29, 2011 21:50:43 GMT -5
Personally, I've proved my point.
If you want to keep going and make an ass out of yourself even more than feel free, but I'm rather looking forward to some NEW questions before our argument answers any and all questions the jury might have.
Good luck Parv. |
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